Announcement

**Marco Pontello** · 27 Jun 2004, 07:51 AM

I work often with PB/DOS 3.50 (and also the old old Basic 7.1 PDB) on NTFS partitions, under WinXP, and I haven't noticed problems that could be related to the file system.
The same (with BC7) when I was working under OS/2 on HPFS, or NT with the older NTFS.

Bye!

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[This message has been edited by Marco Pontello (edited June 27, 2004).]

**Clay Clear** · 27 Jun 2004, 07:58 AM

Thanks, Marco.

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**Tom Hanlin** · 28 Jun 2004, 12:16 PM

They told you what?

Your DOS programs will be just fine, unless they attempt to employ
extremely low-level disk access. A program intended to defragment a
FAT drive isn't going to do anything healthy to an NTFS drive. But,
I don't know that XP would even permit such an attempt, anyway.

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Tom Hanlin
PowerBASIC Staff

**Clay Clear** · 28 Jun 2004, 07:25 PM

Thanks, Marco and Tom. I have dumped my DOS folders from their
backup CD back to the PB parent folder on the C: drive.

Thanks, again.

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**andre drabs** · 3 Jul 2004, 10:06 AM

Hi, maybe this is not directly related but ...

I use WinXp where i have a NTFS file system. I have problems maintaining
my database while the program is in use since long time...

What Problems?
I have a big "random" database (filelenght is over 2.150.000.000 bytes).
I use a file manager written by me in PB3.50 for dos. I calculate the
database-end-record by the normal "recnum???=lof(x)/reclenght"...

Once my file is over 2.150.000.000 bytes long, lof(buf) returns a wrong
number of bytes where it should return the exact filelenght...

Is that error related to the fact that PB cannot handle files over a given
limit, is it related to the fact that lof(x) has a limit or is there somewhere
a bug that i dont know about ???

Using "datatype ???" it should be posible to access 4,294,967,295 records,
meaning that at max my file would be "4,294,967,295 * 80 bytes" ...

Any-One has an Idea ??

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Never code today what you did not code yesterday ...

[This message has been edited by andre drabs (edited July 03, 2004).]

**Michael Mattias** · 3 Jul 2004, 10:28 AM

>is it related to the fact that lof(x) has

Limit is long integer value: 2,147,000,000 and some change.

(Which I also think is some kind of MS-DOS limitation?)

Of course if LOF() is returning the full 32-bits, and when assigned to a LONG is less than zero, you can convert to DWORD with the BITS??? function.

**andre drabs** · 3 Jul 2004, 03:46 PM

Hi Michael,

If lof() has indeed that limit it is a problem for large databases
since that would mean that the "get" and "put" instructions will
probably have the same limitations... that probable "get" and "put"
limitation is only a factor of the full recordlenght further...

It would also mean that creating databases with more than 2,147,483,647
records would not be possible ... a world-registery f.ex...

I cannot see directly any way around this problem but will do some
further testings... I will post results of my findings here...

I cannot see what Ms-Dos should have to do with it because i use XP
on a NTFS partition while running PB in an XP-window...

Thanks anyway for your reply

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NEVER code TODAY what you DID NOT code YESTERDAY ...

**andre drabs** · 4 Jul 2004, 12:23 AM

Michael,

I came up with a quick and dirty replacement for EOF(x), this one
will give the correct filelenght till 4,294,967,295... I retrieved
the getdta(x,x) and dtasize() in the dirunit.bas file and re-used
that to gather the filelenght.

The get and put instructions are apparantly not limited to
2,147,483,647 records, they will do the job till 4,294,967,295
records... Only that is also the limit of the MyLOF??? so that
the number of records in my database will be limited to
4,294,967,295 / reclenght...

SomeOne has a way around that? Any idea is welcome...

This is the Q&D coding ...
CLS
OPEN"r",1,"mytest.txt",80
Field 1,80 AS tmp$
fr1???=MyLOF???("mytest.txt")
PRINT fr1???
CLOSE
END

FUNCTION MyLOF???(A$) Public
Tmp$=DIR$(A$)
MyLOF???=DtaSize()
END FUNCTION

Coding found in DirUnit.bas in PB example dir
SUB GetDTA(DtaSeg AS INTEGER, DtaOfs AS INTEGER) PUBLIC
! push DS ; save DS for PowerBASIC
! mov AX, &H2F00 ; function 2Fh, get DTA location
! int &H21 ; call DOS
! lds SI, DtaSeg ; point DS:SI at DtaSeg
! mov DS:[SI], ES ; put segment of DTA in variable
! lds SI, DtaOfs ; point DS:SI at DtaOfs
! mov DS:[SI], BX ; put offset of DTA in variable
! pop DS ; restore DS for PowerBASIC
END SUB

FUNCTION DtaSize() PUBLIC AS LONG
DIM DtaSeg AS INTEGER,_
DtaOFs AS INTEGER
GetDTA DtaSeg, DtaOfs ' Get DTA address. (See SUB GetDTA
' in this unit.)
DEF SEG = DtaSeg ' Set segment to DTA address segment
FUNCTION = PEEKL(DtaOfs+26) ' Use PB's PEEKL to retrieve four-byte
' file size and convert to long integer.
DEF SEG ' Return segment to previous value.
END FUNCTION

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NEVER code TODAY what you DID NOT code YESTERDAY ...

[This message has been edited by andre drabs (edited July 04, 2004).]

**Michael Mattias** · 4 Jul 2004, 08:08 AM

>It would also mean that creating databases with more than 2,147,483,647
>records would not be possible ... a world-registery f.ex...
>I cannot see directly any way around this problem

Um, how about selecting a different operating system (Windows comes to mind, considering you are already using it) and using a Windows development tool? (I believe PowerBASIC Inc has several suitable offerings). Or, if your heart is set on an MS-DOS application, there may be a third-party data manager capable of handling files this large?

Or, store the data in multiple files, each of a size you can handle.

Lots of ways to solve your challenge. Just takes a little imagination.

**andre drabs** · 4 Jul 2004, 04:53 PM

Michael,

You suggest that i would have to:
1)<<using a Windows development tool? (I believe PowerBASIC Inc has
<<several suitable offerings).
2)<<Or, if your heart is set on an MS-DOS application, there may be
<<a third-party data manager capable of handling files this large?

I did learn programming "back in time (1985)" with Turbo Basic. Since
then i had every new version of Powerbasic (2.0B, 2.10, 3.0a, 3.20, 3.50)
Every time i had to learn new additions, functions and more. At the time
i started there was little or no help, code-exchange nor idea-exchange here
in Belgium. All of my programs are written for hobby and personal use, not
commercial. I am 47 now and feel 18 but i dont plan to continue learning
new languages or styles. Moving to PB for windows is not an option since
that is a direction who will force me at term to continue spending time and
money in learning. I just try to squeese out the max of a language that i
think to know a little, or better, where i feel myself good with.

3)<<Or, store the data in multiple files, each of a size you can handle.
Multiple files are not an option since how do you sort your database then?
Shunk by shunk? No, i bet there is a simple way around the problem of using
longs or quads to save records on a diskfile, just like there was a simple
way around the filesize instruction LOF(x). Maybe it has to be written in
inline assembler but there i am lost... Getting a little help from "the
specialists" would been appreciated, especially by those who can just have
some fun programming and discover (many years too late) how simple some
"for us - amazing -" things can be done...

Speaking of sorting, there is the same problem again. In memory ? I stopped
longtime ago memory-sorts... I modified the quicksort routine to do direct
disk sort... I just moved the limits a bit further, now i am limited by the
"quad-limit" of get & put instruction... Till i or someone resolves that...
------------------
NEVER code TODAY what you DID NOT code YESTERDAY ...

[This message has been edited by andre drabs (edited July 04, 2004).]

**Michael Mattias** · 4 Jul 2004, 04:57 PM

The horse - with or without the carriage - was the best form of transportation for both goods and people - for several hundred years.

But that ended.

**andre drabs** · 4 Jul 2004, 05:04 PM

Just some horses wins races while others loose them...
Not shure Windows is the leading horse...

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NEVER code TODAY what you DID NOT code YESTERDAY ...

**Tom Hanlin** · 6 Jul 2004, 02:27 PM

DOS was not designed to deal with files larger than about 2 GB. You
might, maybe, find a way to work around that a little, under XP,
since the "DOS" is a Windows program. That seems like an extremely
dangerous game to play, though.

If you need to work with larger files, think PB/CC or PB/Win.

------------------
Tom Hanlin
PowerBASIC Staff

**David J Walker** · 19 Jul 2004, 06:27 PM

Hey andre, I'm older than you, and I managed to convert to PBCC from
M$ PDS7.1 with very little trouble.

Now, I just revel in all that memory and those lovely big DWORDS!

Still use the PDS for prototyping a bit though, the debugger is just brilliant.

Go for it!

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DOS Programs Safe For NTFS File System?

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